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Jay Bamrah

Fensport vs Tuning Developments

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2 minutes ago, MartinT said:

Some people have said that if you have boost, the stock manifold and exhaust don't matter. This is wrong. Not only does a good manifold flow a lot better, but I have had differences between them with dyno graphs to prove it.

For instance, my Rogue manifold gives better performance than the TD one I used to have. I do have the TD exhaust, though, which flows well.

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How much does it matter? Enough to where I should have to spend another £1000-£1500 on a header overpipe high flow cat ? 
If all I want is 230WHP would that not be fine on a stock exhaust?

I understand 100% why it would allow people to push 300whp or so but I’m not looking for that I would prefer save money and have 230 and no exhaust so long as having stock exhaust doesn’t put my cars health at risk 

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2 minutes ago, Jay Bamrah said:

How much does it matter? Enough to where I should have to spend another £1000-£1500 on a header overpipe high flow cat ? 
If all I want is 230WHP would that not be fine on a stock exhaust?

I understand 100% why it would allow people to push 300whp or so but I’m not looking for that I would prefer save money and have 230 and no exhaust so long as having stock exhaust doesn’t put my cars health at risk 

It doesn't matter that much, its about optimisation of the setup. The better flow you have from the instake and exhaust the less the engine is punished to make the same power, or can make more.

So often with a forced induction setup if you have a free flowing exhaust you can make a little bit more power with 5psi. Or you could make the same power but with only 4psi.

 

If you blow through a block straw its hard work, if you blow through a larger diameter not blocked straw its easier, the side effect of less free flowing setup is heat.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Rich196 said:

It doesn't matter that much, its about optimisation of the setup. The better flow you have from the instake and exhaust the less the engine is punished to make the same power, or can make more.

So often with a forced induction setup if you have a free flowing exhaust you can make a little bit more power with 5psi. Or you could make the same power but with only 4psi.

 

If you blow through a block straw its hard work, if you blow through a larger diameter not blocked straw its easier, the side effect of less free flowing setup is heat.

 

 

Oh okay so it would help with my engine health then, when we say free flow how free flow we talking like catless header and a high flow 2nd cat?

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As you are talking about exhausts and as others have mentioned, a turbo will come with its own manifold (nearly always catless) and a second decat is recommended as the cats get damaged with the flow, which makes most turbos not Road legal . Friendly MOT mechanic is the only suggested way which i principally disagree to. SC works on intake side not exhaust , so with your gains of 230 WHP and not chasing silly figures, a fully OE exhaust will work easily keeping it road legal and MOT friendly.

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All 3 companies have a good following and have done a lot of work on the gt86 platform so you would be in good hands with either.


I used Tuning developments for my NA tune even though I am in south east England. Well worth travelling for the right services though.

 

Could be worth getting a manifold and tune first either way as a toe in the water. Will also make your next step cheaper as you will have the manifold, ECU licence etc. Although on the flip side you will save a bit of labour time getting it all done at the same time. And the manifold alone wont give you that much extra power just more drivability. I was dead set on going the full hog myself but then ended up sticking with the NA tune so glad I did that first.

 

Don't forget its also not just the cost of the kit. You need all of the associated parts to be able to enjoy it fully. Oil cooler, brakes, tyres etc. Soon adds up to double the price again.

 

If I was picking it would be harrop from abbey or tuning developments turbo as I know many happy people with each.

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15 hours ago, Jay Bamrah said:

If we ignore the distance, what kit for the car would you recommend, budget and reliability is main factors. Maximum power gain etc means nothing to me as all kits get more than enough power to make me happy 

I think everyone else here is best qualified to answer (and already had)....I have neither a SC or a Turbo, I have kept mine NA with just a new exhaust manifold and a remap (at Abbey). I just wanted to suggest Abbey as they're much closer to you, so definitely worth a shout. Best of luck deciding!

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4 hours ago, Jay Bamrah said:

How much does it matter? Enough to where I should have to spend another £1000-£1500 on a header overpipe high flow cat ? 
If all I want is 230WHP would that not be fine on a stock exhaust?

I understand 100% why it would allow people to push 300whp or so but I’m not looking for that I would prefer save money and have 230 and no exhaust so long as having stock exhaust doesn’t put my cars health at risk 

It doesn't matter - if you want 230whp (which translates to around 270bhp) then you can stay with the stock manifold and exhaust.  However, pushing 300bhp (which I am just over) does need those things if you want an efficient system with a modicum of good fuel economy thrown in.

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TD/Fensport/Abbey .. from what it seems, most have fine experiences with all of these. Obviously i doubt that anyone had for his car FI kits from at least two of these, to have some comparison ground for comparison, and most just say good about & advise their choice. That imho won't make decision any easier, so i'd chime in that you should go with any of them that is more local to you.

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If I was going to go Turbo I’d personally go for the Fensport Avo Turbo kit. Firstly because its a brilliant piece of engineering with great build quality and reviews the world over. Secondly because it locates the turbo in a great little spot under the engine.

I’m really not a fan of turbo kits like the TD one that sit the turbo up high behind the bonnet catch. All that increased pipework and heat up near the intake isn’t where I would want it to be.

I guess one downside of the Fensport Avo kit is that its only available as an UEL manifold. Fine if you like that kind of sound but I don't so I went SC instead.

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28 minutes ago, Leeky said:

If I was going to go Turbo I’d personally go for the Fensport Avo Turbo kit. Firstly because its a brilliant piece of engineering with great build quality and reviews the world over. Secondly because it locates the turbo in a great little spot under the engine.

I’m really not a fan of turbo kits like the TD one that sit the turbo up high behind the bonnet catch. All that increased pipework and heat up near the intake isn’t where I would want it to be.

I guess one downside of the Fensport Avo kit is that its only available as an UEL manifold. Fine if you like that kind of sound but I don't so I went SC instead.

Was that the one reason u chose SC or do u also prefer superchargers to turbos generally?

 

I like UELS on my Subaru so that isn’t a problem for me it’s more about total price and reliability.

 

Thankyou for your help!

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On 1/18/2021 at 10:35 PM, AndyK said:

Another vote for Abbey and the Harrop. Have been running since September, has completely transformed the car. I'm running stock manifold, 240whp.

How much did it cost you fully ? Did you install yourself too?

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3 hours ago, Jay Bamrah said:

Was that the one reason u chose SC or do u also prefer superchargers to turbos generally?

Yes totally thats exactly why I went SC. I didn't want an UEL catless header as I didn’t want to risk failing DB checks on track days. Also keeping two cats stops any worries about MOT’s in the future. I was only aiming for 280bhp, so SC gave me the power bump without increasing noise.

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If I was going to go Turbo I’d personally go for the Fensport Avo Turbo kit. Firstly because its a brilliant piece of engineering with great build quality and reviews the world over. Secondly because it locates the turbo in a great little spot under the engine.
I’m really not a fan of turbo kits like the TD one that sit the turbo up high behind the bonnet catch. All that increased pipework and heat up near the intake isn’t where I would want it to be.
I guess one downside of the Fensport Avo kit is that its only available as an UEL manifold. Fine if you like that kind of sound but I don't so I went SC instead.
If its a daily, a low mounted turbo on a low car runs a potential risk of water ingress , especially with deep puddles. Does not happen frequently but is a risk due to design.

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5 minutes ago, BRZ-123 said:

If its a daily, a low mounted turbo on a low car runs a potential risk of water ingress , especially with deep puddles. Does not happen frequently but is a risk due to design.

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True but if you go through a deep puddle even without a turbo you risk thermal shock cracking the hot exhaust manifold or warping a hot brake disc etc. I’d still rather have the turbo placed lower than higher in the engine bay and be sure to avoid deep puddles.

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5 hours ago, Jay Bamrah said:

How much did it cost you fully ? Did you install yourself too?

Abbey did the complete install, ecutek licence, mapping etc. similar to Martin in terms of cost. Although the Harrop kit had increased in price by the time I ordered so a little more. I had uprated discs, pads and lines fitted at the same time so breaking down labour is a bit tricky as it was all as one. Would recommend speaking to Scott or Mark at Abbey, both very helpful.

 

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2 hours ago, BRZ-123 said:

If its a daily, a low mounted turbo on a low car runs a potential risk of water ingress , especially with deep puddles. Does not happen frequently but is a risk due to design.
 

Still uses the OEM airbox, so the intake is no lower than stock.

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Still uses the OEM airbox, so the intake is no lower than stock.
Fair shout. Intake on one side ( not the sucking of water into engine and total write off scenario) , turbo itself runs so hot that any water touching it will cause it to split/ crack and is not a cheap replacement. So the risk exists with low cars like ours and while the design has pros of low cog and potentially lower intake temps , it has cons as well.

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12 hours ago, BRZ-123 said:

turbo itself runs so hot that any water touching it will cause it to split/ crack and is not a cheap replacement.

If you're driving hard enough to get the turbo that hot and then you drive into a lake, I think the turbo will be the least of your worries....

While the hot turbo, cold water scenario is possible, it is highly improbable. I haven't seen any "I wrote my turbo off driving through a puddle" threads on any forum.

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24 minutes ago, KevinA said:

All are experts with the 86, you can talk to them all and go with your own vibe.

I don't think anyone on this forum is arrogant enough to ever insinuate they are an 86 expert. The only real 86 expert I’ve ever met was Tada-san lol

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30 minutes ago, Leeky said:

I don't think anyone on this forum is arrogant enough to ever insinuate they are an 86 expert. The only real 86 expert I’ve ever met was Tada-san lol

He's referring to Abbey, Fensport and Tuning Developments.

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1 minute ago, Conscript said:

He's referring to Abbey, Fensport and Tuning Developments.

Oh I see! My apologies I misunderstood :)

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