Torque Dip

[Ccolleavy 1]

Hi All,

I have been lurking on the forum for a number of months now. I currently do not own GT86/BRZ however I think the savings should allow me to purchase one in October (Hopefully). My main question is the torque dip. Is it really as bad as people make out? The car would be my daily driver and my partner lets just say doesn't like me driving fast (As you may guess it is hard to drive fast in a 1.2ltr Corsa ) but I have always been under the belief a little power is good to get out of sticky situations on the road.
If the torque dip really is that bad is there any way to reduce the dip without changing manifold? would remapping reduce the dip on its own? I am also up for changing the exhaust to de-cat and changing panel filter to allow the car to breathe more.

Cheers,
Connor.

[TTR 509]

Remapping would remove some of the dip, but I guess relatively it could end up feeling worse compared to the gains elsewehere.

Best bet is really to go for a decent manifold and a remap. 

[Ccolleavy 1]

Wouldn't changing the manifold lead to an MOT Failure or is the front cat located elsewhere? 

[TTR 509]

Technically it could fail visual inspection, but nobody ever has. Stock front pipe cat will get you through an MOT no hassle. 

[Lowe 191]

The torque dip is pretty annoying, but the car actually comes with a fantastic free device which helps you get around it.

It's called a gearbox.

Seriously it's nothing worth not buying a twin over, it's just arguably the biggest weakness in what otherwise is a fantastic car. It's also very easily 'fixed' when you get around to modding by means of the manifold and remap as said.

 

 

[sam534 62]

It isn't that bad technically it's not so much a dip as a flat part of a curve

 

Sent from my STF-L09 using Tapatalk

 

 

[nerdstrike 186]

The torque dip only manifests when you're trying to get up and go, it's not really an issue for regular driving. You can dodge it by being agile on the gearstick instead. My main issue with that is it more difficult to be swift-but-lazy. Staying above the torque dip really does require you to rev it out, which can be a bit more aggressive than you really wanted.

It'll be plenty fast compared with a regular Corsa. The lower and grippier stance should make faster driving feel safer too (whether it is or not...)

[Paul 442]

14 minutes ago, TTR said:

Technically it could fail visual inspection, but nobody ever has. Stock front pipe cat will get you through an MOT no hassle. 

MOT tester can't remove the under-floor covers, so they can't see it.

[Church 209]

On track one won't feel torque dip (at ~ 3-3.5K), as rpms are usually 4K to redline. During daily driving .. yes, it can be felt, if accelerating from coasting speed rpms to overtake speed while staying in same gear as if on some turbodiesel .. but i just prefer to drop 2-3 gears down for some audial pleasure and actual acceleration anyway, when need to overtake. When everybody talked about it, it was noticeable .. but now after driving for 2 years it being there doesn't matter. For honda it's VTEC-yo, for ours it's infamous torque dip. Just don't mind it and spool up this little high-redline engine puppy

[GT86JP 24]

Take one for a test drive?

[Lucas 244]

Simply said, if you want an 86, get it. But go for a couple of test drives, before you start worrying about something that someone said. It will feel like a rocket after driving a 1.2. I had a 1.2 Polo at one point myself and my 86 is just amazing compared to that slow stuff  as far as torque dip goes, it's not that bad, you'll have people moaning about something, although there are solution for it, but If you want a lot more power, maybe a 370z would be an alternative in the similar price range? @Ccolleavy

[Lauren 2259]

A remap partially sorts it, but the right manifold makes a torque dip into a torque peak. As long as you have the second cat, you will pass MOT fine. 

Is it really that bad? No, it isn't, it's just that you notice it as it occurs 3-4K rpm which you tend to wander into a lot during daily driving. It doesn't matter if you're driving it hard as you are always above it.  Changing the manifold and remapping makes it a totally different car. 

[Varelco 211]

It depends on how you drive it, some people aren't bothered some are. Im fed up with it now, but I also end up on the motorway alot and  when you cruise at 70-80 you sit right slap bang in the worst of it. I have a Gruppe-S manifold which I will be fitting along with a remap.

[Guest 86guns]

16 minutes ago, Varelco said:

It depends on how you drive it, some people aren't bothered some are. Im fed up with it now, but I also end up on the motorway alot and  when you cruise at 70-80 you sit right slap bang in the worst of it. I have a Gruppe-S manifold which I will be fitting along with a remap.

I find this annoying as well, particularly if you have cruise set at 70ish and you have to slow down, the response to the cruise reset is quite "boggy". 

[Ccolleavy 1]

2 hours ago, Lucas@PartBox said:

Simply said, if you want an 86, get it. But go for a couple of test drives, before you start worrying about something that someone said. It will feel like a rocket after driving a 1.2. I had a 1.2 Polo at one point myself and my 86 is just amazing compared to that slow stuff  as far as torque dip goes, it's not that bad, you'll have people moaning about something, although there are solution for it, but If you want a lot more power, maybe a 370z would be an alternative in the similar price range? @Ccolleavy

Would be just turned 21 when end up buying an 86 so insurance prices are still little higher but affordable thankfully. Therefore 3.7lire 300bhp+ car in a Manchester postcode isn't going to be cheap. Take it this was a supra with very little modifications declared was quoting me £11,000 and I would of had to be female to accent that seen as the insurance provider was just for women. 

[Church 209]

It's not so much exactly about torque dip, but rather moving optimisation to lower rpms - but on NA (and even more so if with stock ecu tune) one can also consider crawford BPB intake spacers for more oumph down low. Yes, once someone decides to go for proper catless headers & proper tune gains from it diminish, but if from beginning one doesn't aim high budget wise but want better performance at low rpms for daily driving - why not?

[Lucas 244]

2 minutes ago, Ccolleavy said:

Would be just turned 21 when end up buying an 86 so insurance prices are still little higher but affordable thankfully. Therefore 3.7lire 300bhp+ car in a Manchester postcode isn't going to be cheap. Take it this was a supra with very little modifications declared was quoting me £11,000 and I would of had to be female to accent that seen as the insurance provider was just for women. 

Yeah, same here. I know the struggle.

[Ccolleavy 1]

I will end up taking a few out for test drives in mid/late September hopefully like @GT86JP said. Just wanted your opinions as well seen as a lot of you know your way around the 86/BRZ. To be honest I don't think the dip would annoy me in the slightest in the first 12months but always good to know options available but still get it to pass MOT and all that. 

[Ccolleavy 1]

6 minutes ago, Church said:

It's not so much exactly about torque dip, but rather moving optimisation to lower rpms - but on NA (and even more so if with stock ecu tune) one can also consider crawford BPB intake spacers for more oumph down low. Yes, once someone decides to go for proper catless headers & proper tune gains from it diminish, but if from beginning one doesn't aim high budget wise but want better performance at low rpms for daily driving - why not?

Thanks @Church I will keep that one in mind, has anyone else gone through this route? 

[Lucas 244]

3 minutes ago, Ccolleavy said:

Thanks @Church I will keep that one in mind, has anyone else gone through this route? 

No, but I was seriously thinking about it. We have them in stock, they will work but will take the power from you in the top end, so I can deal with the torque dip because I know I wont be missing out on having power when I'm messing on the back roads.

[Church 209]

Also for header choice "for down low" i'd think of Ace CS400. They may have less power at redline, but more at lower/mid rpms. Pitty ace headers cost a lot, so that it may make sense to add a bit more and get some forced induction, that will add heap of power and torque at low rpms for sure, way more then NA tuning even in best cases.

[cropzy 66]

I haven't really noticed it too much and it is not really a problem unless your are used to being boosted.

[Lauren 2259]

14 minutes ago, cropzy said:

I haven't really noticed it too much and it is not really a problem unless your are used to being boosted.

It really isn't a big issue. You only notice what an 'issue' it was when you change the manifold and get a big increase in mid-range torque. So what you don't know about, you don't miss really!

[KevinA 695]

After TD manifold and remap.....what torque dip.

[Lauren 2259]

DAFL! After TD EL manifold and remap. What torque dip? 

GT86- Manifold and Exhaust by Lauren Blighton, on Flickr