DaveB 20 Report post Posted December 17, 2014 Thinking of upgrading my brakes; after my last track day they constantly overheated, rumbled and faded. But I want to keep the brake balance er... balanced. What's best??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 What's your budget?I always suggest, in this order:1. Good pads and fluid2. Better vented discsI believe that is all that's necessary. If you track a fair bit you could get good quality track pads and then swap in/out when needed. I have no doubt that good track pads would easily out-do the basic multi-pot calliper "upgrades".Then again, if you're into your big brakes then go for AP/Cosworth IMO and you might as well go for a bigger disc. No point in just going for bigger callipers. The OEM Subaru Brembo setup is an option for the fronts too and if mated with better pads should be a good combo. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smudge 1020 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 As above, budget is needed Some decent pads will work wonders, I think Coordsport have a good deal on some Stoptech discs and pads that I saw recently If you want to go big you're looking at about £2k ffor a front setup Or around £600-£800 if you do the STi Brembo conversion that a few people have done now Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 It also depends what rims you intend to use. At the moment there are no AP brakes for 17" rims but Cosworth are meant to be introducing 330mm front disks soon which will allow the AP calipers to fit. I was mightily impressed with the Cosworth brakes on their demo car... I'm currently using K-Sport 8-pot front calipers with StopTech disks all round, fitted Ferodo DS2400 pads. Good for both road and track, although the front disks are being replaced today due to wear - not surprising the amount of track miles they've done.. Spec K Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Danellen2989 8 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 Guys, Yesterday I took my car to HiSpec Motorsport in Dartford as hey wanted a GT86 to measure up so they can make and supply brake kits for them. Whilst there I saw some of their work and they really look impressive. They are quite a bespoke service and are able to make the brake system with your required specification, even as going far as caliper colour and custom caliper branding. They are able to make all kinds of multipot callipers and even monoblocks. They can make stand supply discs of all sizes (I saw a massive one which was going under a set of 22 inch wheels for a Range Rover which wasn't previously available) I highly recommend them and believe they will offer a discount to gt86 members and mention me (just mention Dan and the White Gt86) and speak to Alex who works there. Their prices are really good as well. I highly recommend looking into them. Their site is www.highspecmotorsport.co.uk I will most definitely be getting myself a set of BBKs from them front and rear! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GT86Jay 202 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 The OEM Impreza STI Brembo kit is great value for money in my opinion! Cost £600 to get them on the car with new pads including refurbish. They stop very well, i've never had over heating issues on the road! I've done a 20 minute Snetterton Session and didn't have any problems and Maz has done the sprints on them and not had problems. They stop very well, looks great, bigger discs and a good price. The low weight of the GT86 helps a lot! 1 Tweedbean reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Burn! Motorsport 20 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 I would say if your discs are still good then just go with upgraded pads, hoses and fluid. To retain the balance of the brakes you MUST match front and rear at the same time. You do this relatively cheaply. Decent 5.1 fluid £12, Brake lines £70 and then Pads... well you could spend £300 up but its probably not necessary yet. Avoid pads that are labeled as "race" they will not perform when cold and greatly increase wear rates on the road. Posting commercially I would recommend looking at DIXCEL ES or Z type pads, check out this thread http://www.gt86.org.uk/forums/topic/2139-introducing-dixcel-brake-pads/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 Cheap option is to do shorter on track stints. Stock discs and pads will take a 10 minute track session no problem. 15 minutes and they smoke. That's what I do. 1 KevinA reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Foulsmell 120 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 I'd say you need to consider your tyre set up too. You could have the best brake kit in the world but if your tyres aren't up to the job the they are worthless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ade 517 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 The AP racing Formula 332x26 4-pot front kit fits under the stock rims perfectly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee 82 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 It also depends what rims you intend to use. At the moment there are no AP brakes for 17" rims but Cosworth are meant to be introducing 330mm front disks soon which will allow the AP calipers to fit. I was mightily impressed with the Cosworth brakes on their demo car... I'm currently using K-Sport 8-pot front calipers with StopTech disks all round, fitted Ferodo DS2400 pads. Good for both road and track, although the front disks are being replaced today due to wear - not surprising the amount of track miles they've done.. Spec K I have the AP formula big brake kit (332mm dia discs) that fit under my stock wheels without the need for spacers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
keelerad 256 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 Its the 6 pot version that needs the bigger wheels, 4's will fit Alec Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Burn! Motorsport 20 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 Cheap option is to do shorter on track stints. Stock discs and pads will take a 10 minute track session no problem. 15 minutes and they smoke. That's what I do. I disagree. An upgrade to some proper pads will be more than sufficient for most here. Just checked the standard disc sizes out as I thought they might be useful for this thread. Front 294 x 24 vented Rear 290 x 18 solid IMO they are pretty decent sizes. If you are looking to do longer track sessions then a simple upgrade to the pads and discs will be more then capable. At that point if you are cooking discs then upgrade the discs to a higher carbon heat treated discs. A bigger disc is not always better. It may manage more heat but it will inevitably weight more, cost more and be more likely the cause for a wheel upgrade. If money is no object then high end BBK's will obviously be the choice. However I have many times seen cars with poorly balanced brakes being outperformed by well balanced standard set ups with well chosen pads. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 I'm not really sure what you are disagreeing about? I never do more than ten minute sessions on track. The only exception being the allocated 15 minutes we had at Lydden Hill this year, where my brakes were smoking, but at that point still working fine. So I wil reiterate my earlier point that if you stick to around ten minutes at a time on track then the stock pads are absolutely fine. I think the standard pads are 'proper' pads plus I managed nearly 40K miles on them including a number of trackdays and sprints and 11 passes of the Alps! So in that respect they are very good indeed. I wonder how long these aftermarket pads will last? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Burn! Motorsport 20 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 I'm not really sure what you are disagreeing about? I never do more than ten minute sessions on track. The only exception being the allocated 15 minutes we had at Lydden Hill this year, where my brakes were smoking, but at that point still working fine. So I wil reiterate my earlier point that if you stick to around ten minutes at a time on track then the stock pads are absolutely fine. I think the standard pads are 'proper' pads plus I managed nearly 40K miles on them including a number of trackdays and sprints and 11 passes of the Alps! So in that respect they are very good indeed. I wonder how long these aftermarket pads will last? I miss read your post. I thought you said "cheap option will do for short sessions" implying that the set up I suggested wouldn't be suitable for more than ten minutes. Sorry my bad. :bangheadonwall 1 Lauren reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Burn! Motorsport 20 Report post Posted December 18, 2014 I think the standard pads are 'proper' pads plus I managed nearly 40K miles on them including a number of trackdays and sprints and 11 passes of the Alps! So in that respect they are very good indeed. I wonder how long these aftermarket pads will last? The ES would outlast the OEM. The Z's probably wouldn't but there would be no need to pull off the track every ten minutes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 Good thread! Lots of interesting and useful data.. Yep - AP 332mm 4-pots will fit under stock rims... at a ridiculous UK price.... how much did they cost you, Lee? (Pitman did a deal via the USA, I believe... you can now engage the services of a 'personal shopper' over there who will buy/ship at 1.6% of your bill... you've still got shipping/duty/VAT to pay on importation but if the cost over there is 40% or more cheaper than UK it's a goer.. this info is from Daily Telewag last week...) Thanks for the heads up on the Dartford firm, Dan. I shall be having words with them... if Cosmurf cannot get their brake dance together I'll go elsewhere... Spec K Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Duff 79 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 So if I've got this right, if you are just a daily driver with no track use then the OEM brakes and pads are fantastic, last ages and hard to beat; if you are a daily driver and go on track runs for up to 10 mins then the OEM brakes and pads are fantastic, last ages and hard to better; but if you drive on a track for 11 minutes or more you may wish to upgrade either pads, brakes or both? Glad that's sorted Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Burn! Motorsport 20 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 So if I've got this right, if you are just a daily driver with no track use then the OEM brakes and pads are fantastic, last ages and hard to beat; if you are a daily driver and go on track runs for up to 10 mins then the OEM brakes and pads are fantastic, last ages and hard to better; but if you drive on a track for 11 minutes or more you may wish to upgrade either pads, brakes or both? Glad that's sorted I think Lauren is trying to say for many people they will be fine. Which is true. Not that they can't be improved on. For me they would probably be okay on the road. But on the track they would not. I have faded the standard brakes on many higher performance cars within shorter time frames on the circuit. I don't want to pit for a cool down every ten minutes as I generally drive track sessions of about 30 minutes. Sessions of over 20 minutes will be very hard on a car. And ware rates on everything will be dramatically accelerated - brakes, oil, tyres etc. For what can be spent on the classic BBK you can afford the set of better tyres and that extra oil change. Then get better value from your track time. Which is ultimately what I am looking for. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rob275 1817 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 I find 15-20 minutes enough on track for me. Anything else my concentration seems to diminish. Which isn't what I want as it potentially puts myself and other circuit users in danger. So i'm after some pads that will just last that little bit longer with potentially a little bite. Best brakes is like a can of worms. It's clear so far from this thread there are many varying opinions and I guess it's much like tyres and geo setup. It's all down to personal preference. Obviously some opinion is nice but at the end of the day it should be your own choice 1 Burn! Motorsport reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee 82 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 Good thread! Yep - AP 332mm 4-pots will fit under stock rims... at a ridiculous UK price.... how much did they cost you, Lee? £1400 I believe with DS2500 pads Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 Ouch! Did that include rear rotors/pads? Spec K Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee 82 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 Nope, that was front calipers, adapters, lines, 2 piece discs and pads, these http://www.part-box.com/product_info.php?products_id=117408 with the ds2500 pads. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 So if I've got this right, if you are just a daily driver with no track use then the OEM brakes and pads are fantastic, last ages and hard to beat; if you are a daily driver and go on track runs for up to 10 mins then the OEM brakes and pads are fantastic, last ages and hard to better; but if you drive on a track for 11 minutes or more you may wish to upgrade either pads, brakes or both? Glad that's sorted Yep, that's it! I'm sure you can get pads that will fare better than the stock pads. It's just as an all rounder they are fine if you don't do long track sessions. Personal preference and all that. I did look at Project Mu as I know they do good pads. As I'm sprinting stock pads and discs are fine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DaveB 20 Report post Posted December 19, 2014 Phew, hadn't looked back at this post because work was so busy. What a response! I think I'll just keep on with the stock pads because if I fit bigger front discs then it may be hard to get the car sliding on the way in. Upgrade the pads next time maybe. Also have tried lifting off at before the braking points to save pads and fuel; it's quite hard to judge how fast to go into a corner unless the ABS is pulsing away! And will turn of the TC as that seemed to shag the pads and discs last time. Budget is limited because I've got new daily driver arriving in Feb. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
