rob275 1817 Report post Posted May 10, 2014 I'm slow dude lol, I have loads of work to do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keethos 842 Report post Posted May 10, 2014 Oh with the exception of Lauren who is a racing driver and rob who is probably the quickest FI novice amongst us. I've corrected that for you James 2 CHOSENMAN007 and GT86Jay reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted May 10, 2014 Actually most of the better new discs have J hook design and that's to increase bite. Having pad deposits on the disc isn't actually a bad thing, ever read how to bed in track/race pads? You need to heat the pad up so much to leave a thin layer of pad material on the disc. Again, glazing happens due to the inability to lose heat, slotted wont help that. Have a read of this: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63781 Also it's worth of noting that more pistons ("pots") on a caliper doesn't mean better braking. If you haven't increased the master cylinder size the braking effort isn't increased. The extra braking effort in a typical BBK is due to the larger discs and pads. STi brake setup: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23512 Too much theory (in my opinion) Steve, ... better to give experience than rhetoric. Spec K 1 GT86Jay reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pitman 188 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Can the OP, or one of the mods / admin PLEASE correct the spelling of BRAKE in this thread? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Can the OP, or one of the mods / admin PLEASE correct the spelling of BRAKE in this thread? That's been driving me nuts for days. Now corrected! 1 GT86Jay reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pitman 188 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Thanks, Lauren . It almost stopped me from coming onto the forum. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GT86Jay 202 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Thanks, Lauren . It almost stopped me from coming onto the forum. Me too! Although it's more certain forum members that seem to always want to argue that make me wanting to stop coming on.... 1 Kodename47 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Too much theory (in my opinion) Steve, ... better to give experience than rhetoric. Spec K I agree. But there is a shortage of people who have tried all appropriate configurations to give honest feedback. There are some serious track junkies (the CSG lot) on the US forum who spend their time doing very hard laps and their recommendation is that good fluid and pads is all you really need. My personal opinion is that if I've spend good money on decent pads, and plain discs give the same performance as slotted discs, then I want to get the longest life out of my pads as possible. Jay, its just good debate. I just thought it was worth noting what other changes you had made to put it into context. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GT86Jay 202 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Absolutely I agree. But to outright say Slotted discs will be no benefit over solid discs is jumping the gun in my opinion. If that was true slotted discs would not exist. I like the fact we can all share experiences and opinions. But giving a single opinion and not exploring others is a little narrow-minded. One setup will work for some people, others will work well for many people. Some people don't have the need for extreme brake pads. Or the money. Also some people will be modding for fast-road not 24 hour laps of spa. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHOSENMAN007 81 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Just go scrappers and get some used Porsche carbon ceramics he he.. Either way as long as you stop better with pads, full kits, slotted, drilled etc what's the drama.. I'm sure anything or configuration we both on will be better than the OEM set up. I just want to upgrade as I will be going f.I and OEM brakes are not designed for another 100 odd of ponies. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHOSENMAN007 81 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Meant to say bolt on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 I agree. But there is a shortage of people who have tried all appropriate configurations to give honest feedback. There are some serious track junkies (the CSG lot) on the US forum who spend their time doing very hard laps and their recommendation is that good fluid and pads is all you really need. My personal opinion is that if I've spend good money on decent pads, and plain discs give the same performance as slotted discs, then I want to get the longest life out of my pads as possible. Jay, its just good debate. I just thought it was worth noting what other changes you had made to put it into context. Yes. But have *YOU* spent good money on decent pads? Have you, personally, tried slotted/drilled disks? We are not Merkinland, different roads/atmosphere (apart from their pollution on the Gulf Stream)/driving style. And a completely different culture in regards to show/shine/pimp my ride.. Steve - it is easy to spout rhetoric without personal experience and most - if not all - who should discuss brakes/disks should be talking from experience. Preferably on a GT86, not on a Ford/Frump/Gizmo... I'm not ".. having a go.." at you - but I find Merkin GT86 rhetoric full of verbiage... that's silage with verbs, by the way... Fly a dozen of their finest over here and they'd be completely bamboozled at a half-decent sprint/racetrack.. ... jeez, they run on octane fuel I wouldn't use in my lawnmower.. CSG? 'Can't Stand Golf' Spec K 2 Pitman and CHOSENMAN007 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Me too! Although it's more certain forum members that seem to always want to argue that make me wanting to stop coming on.... Byee.... Spec K Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 If that was true slotted discs would not exist.My general thoughts is that it's more because it has historical benefits, or that on some cheaper pad compounds that do still create gases then there is a benefit. There is also the cosmetic "benefit". Race cars will benefit from the increased bite you get, but noticed what type of discs F1 cars use?I am in no way close minded and at no point have I said that slotted discs are crap. All I've said is that I don't deem anything more than plain discs as necessary (or an upgrade) and spending that money on better pads would, in my opinion, be money better spent. Actually finding a good solution to give a decent air flow to cool the brakes off will give you the best fade resistance over anything else. It's not a simple solution on the 86 though as there's no easy way of opening up the bumper to allow air through.How to make cars stop better:- Better pad material- Increase pad size (more pad to disc contact)- Move pad further away from the centre of the wheel- Increase piston pressure (This is master cylinder related and not to be confused with adding more calliper pistons)- Better tyres (often forgotten)How to reduce fade:- Improve system ventilation- Increase disc size- Increase pad to disc contact area- Better brake fluid Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Yes. But have *YOU* spent good money on decent pads? Have you, personally, tried slotted/drilled disks?No I haven't but when I finally get round to it I'll be getting some well reputed pads and fluid. Job done. I can't run a BBK as I'm on OEM wheels but I would be tempted to run the STi kit if I had the space.The only way we can test different discs is to get 2 cars with the same pads and test them back to back. I'd honestly be interested to see the results.My last car I fitted some very decent pads on, and was the only change I made. The difference was unbelievable and the abuse they could take was awesome. It's worth noting that, while not the GT86, the weight to brake sizing was at a very similar ratio. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GT86Jay 202 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 but noticed what type of discs F1 cars use? Did you actually just compare our GT86 Road Brakes to Full Carbon F1 Discs that probably cost more than our entire car? I agree a £2500 Solid Carbon Ceramic Disc fitted to a McLaren P1 is probably better than a £150 slotted disc fitted to my GT86. Anyway. What we've discovered is there are many setups depending on budget and personal opinion. I think thats job done for this thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Fly a dozen of their finest over here and they'd be completely bamboozled at a half-decent sprint/racetrack..I wouldn't bank on that, they have a much bigger autoX/track scene than here.Anyway, a thread you may find interesting is by one of the CSG lot comparing actual track use of different pads:http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23680It is worth noting that quite a few run 2 sets of pads, one for road use and the other are proper track pads, where as most of us would want a pad that is suitable for both.BTW, CSG - CounterSpace Garage. They do a lot of suspension and brake work, have 2/3 FR-S/BRZ which have seen more track abuse than most and they are used to driving similar types of car on track (S2k, MX-5 etc). Their opinion is probably one of the most valid on that site. 1 ShinyBRZ reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LFA 68 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 I don't think the stock car is under braked, either from a feel or endurance perspective, ( where as for example the R35 GTRs brakes were IMHO marginal, suffering significant fade and durability issues on the drilled disks. ) That said, you can reach the limits of the 86RZ brakes on track. If you want feel, then lines and pads will deliver. If you want endurance, almost exclusively a tracking concern for this car, then you need a disk specification that cools well ( not just about disk diameter or really drilled vs j hook vs whatever) and a pad that will take the heat. 2 Kodename47 and ShinyBRZ reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHOSENMAN007 81 Report post Posted May 11, 2014 Wow what a topic this has become. Im just going to buy what mark says if good. Job done. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHOSENMAN007 81 Report post Posted May 12, 2014 Hey knightrider, speaking on experience.. Tell me the difference you have experienced from having your manifold de catted and a HFC front pipe put in from the stock manifold and a normal de cat pipe on the sprintex system.? Yes I know whole new subject but need to ease of the friction on the brake pads Lol... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted May 12, 2014 Hey knightrider, speaking on experience.. Tell me the difference you have experienced from having your manifold de catted and a HFC front pipe put in from the stock manifold and a normal de cat pipe on the sprintex system.? It's hard to comment - I did most of the bits in one go although it does work. I did fit an HFC on the stock car and it didn't make much of a difference. I haven't used a de-cat pipe on my car at any point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHOSENMAN007 81 Report post Posted May 12, 2014 OK. Thanks mate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 442 Report post Posted May 12, 2014 Steve - did you not fit the (prototype) de-catted standard manifold when you fitted your HFC? Spec K Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodename47 446 Report post Posted May 12, 2014 Steve - did you not fit the (prototype) de-catted standard manifold when you fitted your HFC? Spec K Nope. HFC > SC > Mani In that order, all over 2 weeks or so. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CHOSENMAN007 81 Report post Posted May 12, 2014 OK. So does it feel better? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
