jimmymac 9 Report post Posted June 3, 2015 I lent my GT86 TRD to a friend (Paul Woodford) who's a motoring presenter on sky so he could do a review of it. Thought you guys might be interested in seeing it so I'm sharing it here Here's the blog post http://paulwoodford.co.uk/2015/06/01/getting-to-know-the-toyota-gt86/ and the video https://youtu.be/KEbBPsNm_js 2 chillismoke and Keethos reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 4, 2015 In the nicest possible way and no offence intended. The written review is not a review. I watched the video. I think your friend presents very well. But it's a pity all he did was describe the car rather than review it. For his comments about it's 'cracking' chassis he just didn't talk about driving feel and explore that in any depth. So I think it lacked any depth overall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmymac 9 Report post Posted June 4, 2015 Yeh, It's just his style is to tell a story rather than go to in to much depth, he'd have to hire a race track for a proper review. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicebiscuit 655 Report post Posted June 4, 2015 Yeh, It's just his style is to tell a story rather than go to in to much depth, he'd have to hire a race track for a proper review. Why? Just curious, but I'd have thought B road driving impressions more relevant to the average prospective owner. Track reviews are the scourge of the ordinary buyer. I had an Abarth 500 which got reasonable reviews in some quarters. Indeed on perfect track-like tarmac it was a good handling car and a lot of fun. Trouble is, on a bumpy road it completely fell apart, so the majority of the time it was hopeless. Hardly any of the reviews told me that. 2 Lauren and Keethos reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 4, 2015 It's why I read mags like EVO because they do in-depth reviews of cars and test them on a variety of terrain. I know the EVO Triangle well enough and the roads they used, so it gives me a much better picture. Driving a B road or a decent A road is what I'd expect tbh in any review. Not wishing to criticise your friend, he presents very well, but I'd rather a review than a story. That was the problem always with TG, they seemed to missed the point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicebiscuit 655 Report post Posted June 4, 2015 Yes - sorry - I wasn't having a pop at your mate either - more a general point. :-D What Top Gear were right about was that cars built to get Nurburgring times didn't necessarily make great road cars... (The nail in the coffin of the Abarth was the realisation that I was taking certain corners 10mph faster in my Citroen Berlingo simply because I trusted it more :-D ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 Actually in reference to the Nurburgring, cars that are tested on it to setup the suspension do make great road cars, it's the best track to use in that respect because it is so bumpy and much more like a road than a race track. This is why most manufacturers use it. The 86 was tested a good amount a the Nurburgring. 1 Ade reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicebiscuit 655 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 I'm going to caveat the following with the observation that our views may well differ because you're clearly a very skilled driver, and I most certainly am not... Do you not think that even Nurburgring tuned cars are still a little stiff for quick progress on British roads, certainly in the hands of an average driver? Personally I've always felt quicker with softer set ups, simply because its predictable so even I can drive at 9/10ths whereas a stiffer and gripper set up means I back off for fear of not being able to cope with a 'moment' at the limit. To put in context - possibly the fastest point-to-point car I've driven (in my hands) was some relatively exotic variant of Impreza STi (I forget which exactly). Its set up was relatively compliant, very benign and I could instantly drive twice as fast in it. In fact it was so competent I decided there and then never to buy one, as 'fast' became so easy and normal that I might as well have shredded my license there and then.... :-) 1 Quixote reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmymac 9 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 I'm cool, I'm just happy he wanted to use my car and give the gt86 a little more exposure 4 Nicebiscuit, Lauren, Ztox and 1 other reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Smogz 4 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 In the nicest possible way and no offence intended. The written review is not a review. I watched the video. I think your friend presents very well. But it's a pity all he did was describe the car rather than review it. For his comments about it's 'cracking' chassis he just didn't talk about driving feel and explore that in any depth. So I think it lacked any depth overall. It may lack depth but I think it's fine as a consumer review rather than a critical review. Don't get me wrong Lauren, I also like in depth reviews and assessments, satisfies the geek in me. But there's more than one way to approach things and I think this is a good way to give a first introduction and initial perspective on the car. A review 'lite' Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 Fair play, Jimmy, I don't want to appear over critical of the review at all, I wish I had your friend's presenting skills! NiceBiscuit, I've driven the Ring a number of times. It's the kind of place that has a very good variety of everything in terms of corners, surface and all manner of bumps and dips. It's very far from being a billiard smooth surface like say Silverstone or say Magny Cours. The Abarth has a bit of an issue as they set the rear up pretty stiff. I had a Panda 100hp and whilst it was engaging to a point, it's ride wasn't very good and I think Fiat simply skimped on the development of the car perhaps given it's price bracket. So it's not the Nurburgring's fault, there are only a handful of cars where manufacturers talk Ring laptimes after all, but it is a major testing base simply because it's one of the best places to do it. That the GT86 rides reasonably well proves that you can develop a car's handling round the Ring (as well as many other places) without ruining the ride. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keethos 842 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 I thought the 86 wasn't developed at the ring cos what's his face wasn't interested in lap times etc, it was all about the drive? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 Akio Toyoda participated in the development of the GT86 at the Nurburgring: http://www.tune86.com/ft-86-news/16526-toyota-86-philosophy-interview-tetsuya-tada Driving the Nurburgring, well the Nordschleife is not about lap times, it's all about the drive. There is far more to the Ring than just laptimes! 1 Keethos reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 I will go back to the Ring one day. If there was a heaven, the Nordschleife would be it. I could spend my life driving around there. It could easily be an obsession which is largely why I haven't been back in the last 8 years. The risks there are high, but the thrill of it is like nowhere else. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicebiscuit 655 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 Never been. Would like to though... As for the Abarth - glad I owned it because absolutely ANYTHING rides well after that :-). Some people have managed to sort them a bit - Konis help - but I think that ultimately they were trying to turn it into something it wasn't and I lost patience with it. (I always liked the Panda 100hp by the way - looked like a cross between a training shoe and the box it came in. In a good way) I think you make a valid point that there's a difference between development on the Nordschleife and optimising purely to chase ring lap times... 1 Lauren reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 I took the 100hp on track. It was terribly flawed though as soon as you started getting above 7/10ths. Fiat put lower and much stiffer springs on but the dampers were the same as all the other models. Load it up round a long corner and it would pogo diaganolly as the dampers just could not control the springs! 1 Nicebiscuit reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lauren 2259 Report post Posted June 5, 2015 In regard about laptimes, apart from the hypercar trio we all know about, there are not that many other cars that try to set lap records for their class. Of course exceptions like the Megane RS Trophy with the Nurburgring option box ticked is going to be more hardcore than the usual one, but you'd expect that of course. Primarily the Ring is used to test the handling with a great mix of, well everything. When you go there you often see development cars all over the place. It's an absolute mecca that place really. Just petrolhead heaven. For most cars it's about feel, balance and involvement above anything else and that's really what the Ring is all about. The best road you'll ever drive that happens to be one way and is used as a racetrack. Though it was built as a racetrack of course. 1 Nicebiscuit reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
