Brake upgrades - discs/pads?

[Ade 517]

That's actually quite a lot cheaper than I thought it would be. Very tempting indeed. The four pots will fit under 17" wheels too. 
I notice it comes with DS2500, which a lot don't seem to like. Are they going to be up to the job? I guess a much bigger contact patch and bigger discs will help. 

Bare in mind the cheaper versions use the reyland disc with straight vanes whereas AP disc have curved vanes which they claim improves cooling by 30%.

The extra cooling capacity comes from the larger surface area and higher airflow throug the vanes.

Its the same pad shape as the old cp5200 which is oe fitment to a few tvrs, aston martins ect and countless bbks. So pads arnt expensove at all.

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[Lauren 2259]

Yeah sure, there is a reason why the Ryland discs are cheaper. But I would expect it to still far exceed stock brakes and aftermarket pads and well, discs are consumables of course. Good news on the replacement pads then. 

[Gary p 46]

I have Ksport bbk and are great value and really good. These are curved vanes as these are based on AP. Don't get me wrong AP and stoptech are the mutts nuts but I rate highly of KSPORT just need a good pad👍

[MikeB 79]

1 hour ago, Lauren said:

That's actually quite a lot cheaper than I thought it would be. Very tempting indeed. The four pots will fit under 17" wheels too. 

I notice it comes with DS2500, which a lot don't seem to like. Are they going to be up to the job? I guess a much bigger contact patch and bigger discs will help. 

I have had no issues with DS2500 and run braided hoses with Castrol SRF. As you know I need a lot of feel with my brakes and had no problems on or off track but AP set up looks good and very tempting.

[Lauren 2259]

1 hour ago, Ade said:

Bare in mind the cheaper versions use the reyland disc with straight vanes whereas AP disc have curved vanes which they claim improves cooling by 30%.


 

I just had another look, there are options for straight, J-hook or curved grooves with the Reyland discs, so that option is there. 

[VAD17 479]

I have Ksport bbk and are great value and really good. These are curved vanes as these are based on AP. Don't get me wrong AP and stoptech are the mutts nuts but I rate highly of KSPORT just need a good pad

Do you have Ksports front only? And if so which rear rotors do you have and has it affected bias much?
Also do you have experience/ views with different pads on KSports and your preference for road and track set up?
Thanks

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[VAD17 479]

I have Ksport bbk and are great value and really good. These are curved vanes as these are based on AP. Don't get me wrong AP and stoptech are the mutts nuts but I rate highly of KSPORT just need a good pad

Do you have Ksports front only? And if so which rear rotors do you have and has it affected bias much?
Also do you have experience/ views with different pads on KSports and your preference for road and track set up?
Thanks

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[Deacon 1357]

36 minutes ago, Lauren said:

I just had another look, there are options for straight, J-hook or curved grooves with the Reyland discs, so that option is there. 

That's for the external grooves. The AP original discs have curved internal vanes for potentially better cooling. 

[Ade 517]

I just had another look, there are options for straight, J-hook or curved grooves with the Reyland discs, so that option is there. 

Sorry I am taking about the internal vanes. The vented part between the two solid outside surfaces. On the reyland its essentially and solid bit of iron with holes drilled in it like an oem disc. AP discs have curves vanes so it acts like a centrifugal fan and you get better airflow. Not as easy to cast thought.

AP can also provide different types of grooves in the surface on the discs. Id recomment curved grooves but J hook are also good but can encourage a bit more noise than curved vanes.

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[Gary p 46]

23 minutes ago, VAD17 said:

Do you have Ksports front only? And if so which rear rotors do you have and has it affected bias much?
Also do you have experience/ views with different pads on KSports and your preference for road and track set up?
Thanks

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I have Ksport up front with EBC red stuff pads tarox discs at rear with EBC pads standard calliper.  Braided hoses all round with motul 5:1 brake fluid. All admittent pads where poo until they bedded in but good now, good for road use. I mainly have mine on the car for looks but made a massive difference to the stopping power. Certainly feel more confident.

[Church 209]

Lauren: imho DS2500 are relatively among best hybrid pads out there. While they are not real track pads, but as default choice for something mainly used on streets and occasionally on track, far from worst choice. I have to admit, my experience with them is mostly with stock brakes, so with cooler running on BBKs they may make worse part of "street" pad, but i see nothing to not like for them. There is reason, why DS2500 is that popular among subaru crowd.

[Ade 517]

Forgot to add - yes I agree the reyland discs offer good value and cirtainly better heatsinking than oem which is also stright/drilled vanes.

Martin Hadland (of reyland motorsport) also sells replacement discs for just about any brake kit ever made.

Price difference when I came to replace my discs was £295 vs £400 (with part box discount) for the pair. So for the sake of £100 I went with the AP option and a soft pad.

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[Lauren 2259]

Okay seriously thinking about going for the AP option. What fluid is recommended? 

[Deacon 1357]

9 minutes ago, Lauren said:

Okay seriously thinking about going for the AP option. What fluid is recommended? 

Castrol srf if you want the best. Rbf 660 or ate type 200 are also very well rated (and much cheaper). 

[Kodename47 446]

How about Miller's 300+? Seems on par with the above, just Americans don't use Miller's stuff (oils and brake fluid), presumably as it's UK based and rare over there.

[TTR 509]

1 minute ago, knightryder said:

How about Miller's 300+? Seems on par with the above, just Americans don't use Miller's stuff (oils and brake fluid), presumably as it's UK based and rare over there.

I've used Millers 300, awesome stuff. Highly recommend. 

[Minion 132]

12 hours ago, Lauren said:

That's actually quite a lot cheaper than I thought it would be. Very tempting indeed. The four pots will fit under 17" wheels too. 

I notice it comes with DS2500, which a lot don't seem to like. Are they going to be up to the job? I guess a much bigger contact patch and bigger discs will help. 

That's what I thought when I saw them, the original plan was to get K-sports but for the extra money I'm sure they'll be worth it. Just gotta save up now like always 

[MikeB 79]

I use Castrol SRF as it’s higest wet boiling point of 270 which is higher than most of the other makes dry boiling point. It’s expensive though but shopping around you can get it for mid £40 per litre. Used Castrol bike racing and kept with it.

Opie Oils have a good range of manufactures with specs and prices.

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/c-450-car-brake-fluid-clutch-fluid.aspx

[Deacon 1357]

This is quite useful:-

[thetyrant 30]

RBF600 is where I usually start and if kept fresh with a quick bleed before each track outing is usually good enough, Castrol SRF is the best as said above and the wet boiling point (much more important than people think due to fluid absorbing water as soon bottle seal is opened) is leagues ahead of anything else as you can see on above, its not cheap but not stupid money and way better than loosing pedal on track.

 

My advice would be to start with fresh RBF600 and if that doesn't keep pedal firm change to the SRF, if you boil that then learn how to drive!  

 

Ian

[alucardo 55]

I used RBF600 and similar in all my cars and I have never managed to boil them. So never needed SRF so never incurred that cost for fluid. Think your car would have to be seriously quick or heavy to boil it.

[Ade 517]

Honestly. Use Dot 5.1. It doesn't absorb moisture as fast and still has a high boiling point. I used RBF 660 and changed it after 7 months due to soggy pedal. I cant be bothered bleeding the brakes all the time. 

Try dot 5.1 and if you boil the fluid, go up to a higher temp fluid but dont waste money on race fluid you probably wont need. Whole point of a BBK like this is to allow the use of softer streetable pads and normal fluid. Race pads and fluid should be reserved for Race calipers/setups which are designed to glow red/smoke/take abuse and still work. 

Having said that I used cheap Valvoline dot 5.1 with race pads (clubracers) making them smoke like a mother trucker and the fluid was fine. I did bleed the calipers after every track day though just to be safe.

 

 

 

[Lauren 2259]

Thanks for all the info on fluid and stuff.

Just ordered the kit from Brummie land. Should be landing at RRG for Friday or Monday. Reckon I'll try 5.1 then and see how I go which Richard should be able to get for me.

[TTR 509]

1 minute ago, Lauren said:

Thanks for all the info on fluid and stuff.

Just ordered the kit from Brummie land. Should be landing at RRG for Friday or Monday. Reckon I'll try 5.1 then and see how I go which Richard should be able to get for me.

Good choice!

[thetyrant 30]

Personally i always avoid dot 5.1 for the reason it generally has a much lower dry and wet boiling point compared to racing dot4's as you can see in chart above.

 

 Dry boiling point is only relevant for when you first open bottle, as all dot 3/4/5.1 fluids start to absorb moisture as soon as you open the sealed bottle the wet boiling point is just as critical,  unless you bleed system on regualr basis keeping it fresh, this is why the Castrol SRF is thought of as the best  

 

Some look to Dot5 which is a totally different thing and doesnt absorb moisture at all and doesnt damage paint if spilled, however downside is not all seals work with it and when it does boil you often get no warning, it goes from hard pedal to nothing at all usually!, unlike dot 3/4/5.1 etc which usually start going spongy before pedal goes completley

 

Ian